Agenda and minutes

Scrutiny Advisory Board - Adults
Friday, 4th October, 2019 10.00 am

Venue: Committee Room 1 - County Offices, Kendal, LA9 4RQ. View directions

Contact: Lorraine Davis  Email:

No. Item



To receive any apologies for absence.



Apologies for absence were received from Mr D Gawne, Dr S Haraldsen and Mr G Roberts.



To report and note changes to the membership of the Board.



Members noted that Mr A Wonnacott was substituting for Mr G Roberts for this meeting only.




Members are invited to disclose any disclosable pecuniary interest they have in any item on the agenda which comprises


1          Details of any employment, office, trade, profession or vocation carried on for profit or gain.


2          Details of any payment or provision of any other financial benefit (other than from the authority) made or provided within the relevant period in respect of any expenses incurred by you in carrying out duties as a member, or towards your election expenses.  (This includes any payment or financial benefit from a trade union within the meaning of the Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992.


3          Details of any contract which is made between you (or a body in which you have a beneficial interest) and the authority


(a)     Under which goods or services are to be provided or works are to be executed; and


            (b)     Which has not been fully discharged.


4          Details of any beneficial interest in land which is within the area of the authority.


5          Details of any licence (alone or jointly with others) to occupy land in the area of the authority for a month or longer. 


6          Details of any tenancy where (to your knowledge)


            (a)     The landlord is the authority; and


            (b)     The tenant is a body in which you have a beneficial interest.


7          Details of any beneficial interest in securities of a body where


(a)     That body (to your knowledge) has a place of business or land in the area of the authority; and


(b)     Either –


         (i)        The total nominal value of the securities exceeds £25,000 or one hundredth of the total issued share capital of that body; or


         (ii)       If that share capital of that body is of more than one class, the total nominal value of the shares of any one class in which the relevant person has a beneficial interest exceeds one hundredth of the total issued share capital of that class.


In addition, you must also disclose other non-pecuniary interests set out in the Code of Conduct where these have not already been registered.




A “disclosable pecuniary interest” is an interest of a councillor or their partner (which means spouse or civil partner, a person with whom they are living as husband or wife, or a person with whom they are living as if they are civil partners).



There were no declarations of interest at the meeting.




To consider whether the press and public should be excluded from the meeting during consideration of any item on the agenda.



RESOLVED,that the press and public be not excluded from the meeting during consideration of any item on the agenda.



MINUTES pdf icon PDF 79 KB

To confirm as a correct record the minutes of the meeting of the Scrutiny Advisory Board – Adults held on 25 June 2019 (copy enclosed).



With the following amendments to page 9, second paragraph, the word To be changed to The and thanks be changed to thanked it was


RESOLVED,that the minutes of the meeting held on 26 June 2019 be agreed as an accurate record and signed by the Chair.



Shared Lives pdf icon PDF 725 KB

To receive a presentation from the Interim Executive Director – People (copy to follow).



Ms P Fox and Mr A Robinson, Shared Lives Coordinators, attended the meeting and gave a presentation on the scheme that cared for people in ordinary homes by the people who lived in the community.   The officers outlined the key principles of Shared Lives, who it was able to support, eligibility and how the scheme was funded.


Members welcomed the scheme and congratulated the officers on their obvious enthusiasm for it.   Officers confirmed that, although it was a more cost effective alternative to other types of care, cost was not the driving force behind it.  It gave a broader choice of support for people and promoted independence.  The officers outlined the number of arrangements already in place in the county.  Members noted that this scheme had links with the Council’s Thriving Community work.


Members highlighted the importance of reliable public transport to enable people to maintain their independence.


Members, to conclude, thanked the officers for their attendance and it was agreed to circulate a cost comparative of the highest shared lives placement (band 3) with the cost of residential care package.




(1)  the position be noted;


(2)  figures comparing the cost of the highest (Band 3) shared lives placement with the cost of residential care package be provided to members.




To consider a report by the Interim Executive Director – People (copy enclosed).



The Senior Manager – Safeguarding presented a report providing an update and analysis of adult safeguarding activity for the first quarter 2019/2020, briefing members on progress against the key areas of performance relating to Making Safeguarding Personal, providing a benchmark against other local authorities and describing actions planned to strengthen and consolidate improvements in adult safeguarding in Cumbria through the Safeguarding Adults Board.


The report highlighted an increase in numbers of episodes of safeguarding and the Senior Manager outlined the safeguarding process where there has been focused, targeted work to improve services by ensuring a consistent response.  Members noted that there had been a 10% decrease in the number of desired outcomes achieved for individuals.  The officer confirmed that this would be  monitored and reported back to the Board.


The Senior Manager agreed to change the formatting of data in the report for better comparative reading.  A member referred to the low figures of enquiries by type of abuse in South Lakeland and wondered if lessons could be learned from that area.  Members recognised that areas of deprivation were more likely to have an impact on figures.  In answer to a suggestion to carry out a “deep dive” in the Allerdale area, officers said that a consistent approach to the county’s reporting procedures was needed.


To conclude the Officer outlined various updates from the Cumbria Safeguarding Adults Board.


RESOLVED,that the report be noted.




Development of Reasonable Offer for Adult Social Care in Cumbria pdf icon PDF 92 KB

To consider a report and a presentation by the Interim Executive Director – People (copy enclosed).


Additional documents:



Members received a report and presentation by the Senior Manager, Adults providing an overview of the procedure followed in Adult Social Care for calculating a personal budget to meet people’s needs for social care support.


The presentation covered the Council’s principles, the calculation of personal budgets, an explanation of a reasonable offer and how it was formed.  The officer highlighted that the personal budget was the cost to the local authority of meeting the person’s assessed care and support needs.  The reasonable offer considered value for money and affordability of meeting those needs in different settings.


Members queried the costs for different care packages and the number of people in receipt of personal budgets.  The officer explained that everyone who had statutory needs would have a personal budget but it was person specific and there was a need for flexibility.  Direct payments were mentioned and the transparency of the process. 


In discussion of the process, concerns were raised by members on the amount of information that clients needed to absorb when having the personal budget conversations with social workers.  A member raised a query on how clients were to understand the development of the assessment calculations.  It was felt that the setting of the conversation framework and investment in the social workers was needed.  The Senior Manager advised that an IT system would be available to aid calculation and this was welcomed by members.  Members also raised the rights of appeal.


Following on from the discussion, a member raised concerns about parental carers assessment not taking place and people’s concerns undertaking assessments, in case the payments were reduced.  The Assistant Director - (Deputy DAS) hoped the restructure currently taking place in Adult Social Care would address these issues.




(1)   the report be noted;


(2)  figures on the numbers of people in receipt of a personal budget and a breakdown on the levels of funding provided for different packages of care be circulated to members.



Action Plan to deliver the Cumbria Healthwatch report on people with a learning disability pdf icon PDF 82 KB

To consider a report by the Interim Executive Director – People (copy enclosed).


Additional documents:


Members received a report from the Senior Manager-Learning Disability/Mental Health/Autism on the action plan that had been developed following the publication of the Cumbria Healthwatch report, “What does a good life look like for People with Learning Difficulties in Cumbria? – A Platform for Change”.  An action plan had been developed to be a live document to be updated and shared with partners on a regular basis.  The Learning Disability and Autism Partnership Board had agreed to be the conduit for the development and monitoring of the plan.


The officer outlined that one of the key findings from the Cumbria Healthwatch report was that many people with a learning disability were happy with the support received but that expectations and aspirations were low.  The main issues identified for people with a learning disability were friends, relationships and loneliness and a number of actions to address these issues had already taken place. 


In discussion, the Chair raised the issue of health inequalities for those with learning disabilities  Members welcomed the report and suggested actions, including social mapping of opportunities available.  Members suggested input from carers, parents, individuals, businesses and the LEP into the action plan.  It was further suggested that links to the Learning Disability and Autism Disability Partner Board be made.




(1)  the report be noted;


(2)  updates to the Action Plan be circulated to members of the Board for information on a six monthly basis;


(3)  the inequalities for those with learning difficulties be raised at the relevant forum.




Delayed Transfers of Care pdf icon PDF 205 KB

To consider a report by the Interim Executive Director – People (copy enclosed).


Additional documents:


The Board members received a report that looked at the performance of Cumbria with regard to Delayed Transfers of Care (DTOCs).  The report covered the current situation and the understanding of what the drivers were for the system’s performance.


Although Cumbria hadn’t met its Better Care Fund (BCF) target in the first quarter, an improvement in July meant that Cumbria was now meeting its target.  Current action was being undertaken on a number of fronts to address the DTOC situation. These included a system wide review of the use of STRATA (the referral and resource matching IT system) and the establishment of short term intervention teams.  Members were pleased to note the appointment of a countywide manager to strengthen the service area and the intention to have administrators on wards to alleviate pressures on nursing time.  Assistance to help reduce DTOCs had been accepted from the LGA.  The Assistant Director - (Deputy DAS) informed members that a joint Council and Health workshop for frontline staff on the best way forward had been arranged to take place in the next few weeks. 


A lengthy discussion took place around the variance in DTOCs between the North and South of the county, the Discharge to Assess programme and the ramifications that lack of identified funding had on the way of working in the south of the county.  The discharge time for mental health and dementia patients was also discussed.  Members requested comparative figures between Cumbria and other local authorities nationally. 


It was




(1)  comparator information on DTOCs with other local authorities be circulated to members;


(2)  information from the report and discussion be fed back to the Scrutiny Performance Working Group;


(3)  feedback on the performance of the short term intervention teams be provided to the Board members.




To consider a report by the Executive Director – Corporate, Customer and Community Services (copy enclosed).


Additional documents:


The Strategic Policy and Scrutiny Adviser introduced his report updating members of new and updated items of significance to the Adults Board. 


Members were informed that the Forward Plan from 1 October to 30 November included the key decision on Integrated Commissioning Arrangements with North Cumbria Clinical Commissioning Group.  The Scrutiny Performance Working Group had met on 3 July and progress had been made in a number of areas such as an increase in the number of foster carers and the rebranding of Cumbria Care.


Scrutiny Management Board had, at its meeting in September, agreed the continuation of the Joint Advisory Group for a further twelve months.  The officer informed the Board that the focus would be on the work undertaken to prevent and mitigate the impact of Adverse Childhood Experiences throughout life.


Members considered the Board’s work programme which was appended to the report.


RESOLVED, that the report be noted.




To note that the next meeting of the Scrutiny Advisory Board – Adults is scheduled for 16 January 2020 at 10 am at Cumbria House, Carlisle.




It was noted that the next meeting of the Scrutiny Advisory Board – Adults be held on 16 January 2020 at 10.00 am at Cumbria House, Carlisle.